#1 January 17th, 2005 11:07 AM

theda

Member

a question for the ISM ladies...

I was just curious as to what other women thought of strangers that refer to you as "gorgeous, love, darl etc". I don't mind a friend or intimate calling me such things but I really object to total strangers calling me this, reducing me to femininsed adjectives! I was walking down the street about 10 minutes ago and this raver guy said "hello gorgeous". and i said "don't call me gorgeous", to which he responded by calling me a whore and slut and a bitch.
So do you think its overreacting to tell idiots like that not to call me those words? Am I just nitpicking? Or is it a legitimate although minor form of sexism? It's kind of like if I went up to random men and said "hello muscles" or "hello tough guy" or something. Or am I just going over the top here?

gtrvox

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

I was just curious as to what other women thought of strangers that refer to you as "gorgeous, love, darl etc". I don't mind a friend or intimate calling me such things but I really object to total strangers calling me this, reducing me to femininsed adjectives! I was walking down the street about 10 minutes ago and this raver guy said "hello gorgeous". and i said "don't call me gorgeous", to which he responded by calling me a whore and slut and a bitch.
So do you think its overreacting to tell idiots like that not to call me those words? Am I just nitpicking? Or is it a legitimate although minor form of sexism? It's kind of like if I went up to random men and said "hello muscles" or "hello tough guy" or something. Or am I just going over the top here?

I have often disagreed (not always responded, though) with your comments but I think you're bang on in this issue. I think it's alright to say a nuetral "Hi" to a starnger in the park (at least here in Toronto it's common practice); you may make a comment about the weather or their beautiful dog - but certainly not "Hello gorgoeus". That's like something out of a 1930's movie....not acceptable in my opinion. But then the guy reveals his true colours by calling you names and you know you're dealing with a butthead punk, so I guess no surprise there.

Having lived in London, England, though, I do recall that people (especially older ladies but men, as well) will call you "luv" - whether you're a man or a woman. A custom, I guess - not in the same category as "Hello gorgeous"

Btw, I am of the male persuasion and you asked for female opinions - hope that's ok ;-)

ixnay3

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

Theda, I think you are right on. It shows a complete lack of respect and treats you in a patronising manner.
Personally its not something I would do.
Interesting point made about some English habits. This does happen, and yes it only generally happens with people of about 40 yrs or older. In the north of England one often gets referred to as "love" or "my love". I like quaint old colloquialisms (sp?) like that.
Down here in the west of England they say (All right my lover) - same sort of deal.
But "Hey darlin'" I would find objectionable if I was female.

voyeur2

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

I was just curious as to what other women thought of strangers that refer to you as "gorgeous, love, darl etc". I don't mind a friend or intimate calling me such things but I really object to total strangers calling me this, reducing me to femininsed adjectives! I was walking down the street about 10 minutes ago and this raver guy said "hello gorgeous". and i said "don't call me gorgeous", to which he responded by calling me a whore and slut and a bitch.
So do you think its overreacting to tell idiots like that not to call me those words? Am I just nitpicking? Or is it a legitimate although minor form of sexism? It's kind of like if I went up to random men and said "hello muscles" or "hello tough guy" or something. Or am I just going over the top here?

Hi a male opinion here.  I hope I am not seen as trying to justify the scene you reported in your intro to the topic.  What the raver said and replied with is really low class indeed.  Context is important in conversation with strangers.  In a bar or at an informal social gathering I think a hello like that might be acceptable in that there is a sort of implied permission to approach just by being there.
In a general public place formal manners are more important.  A civil hellow would be all right in my opinion. 

As to receiving on the street compliments from women - bring 'em on! The best I have gotten is "Nice hat!" a couple of times when I was wearing a nice Tilly hat of all things.  Made my day.  And from women quite a bit younger than me.

However I am not nearly as good looking a man as you are a good looking woman, Theda, and I can imagine how tiresome it would get to have a string of public assesments of your physique trail you around.  So I for one avoid staring obviously, and / or commenting on the beauty I see on the street.  And I think this is the only appropriate way.  I fyou noticed me looking I might wink though.

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Have I ever lied to you before?

lucille

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

i often find that men respond to me in a patronizing way such as you have described, darl.

funny how you graduated from gorgeous to slut within the blink of an eye and all because you responded with force.  If you are passive then you are gorgeous and desirable and if you are aggressive then you are the worst form of woman a ‘whore’. 

In this circumstance I usually use the power of facial expression and give the guy sometin so brutal with my eye that he feels immediately uncomfortable, and also follow this with a long disapproving gaze up and down his body and returning and focusing on the groin area.  Give em some of their own medicine I say, and it sure works from 60 year old men to teenagers. 

Similarly if you are walking down the street just trying to do your ting, and a man blatantly checks your shit out.  There is nothing inherently wrong with appreciating the beauty of the world, of course but it often happens in a disrespectful way.  So I counteract this with the same.  If they are going to check out my ‘womanhood’, then I have every right to check out their tackle.  Men usually get embarrassed and stop ogling at you. 

Fight fire with fire? I dunno if it just means that I am becoming ‘like them’ and approaching the world from an aggressive male perspective but it sure helps me get through the day, and I had a bit of a chuckle last time I did it to a 60plus Indian man who presumed that his fly must have been opened and quickly covered his shit up. That’s how I feel man!

theda

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

i often find that men respond to me in a patronizing way such as you have described, darl.

funny how you graduated from gorgeous to slut within the blink of an eye and all because you responded with force.  If you are passive then you are gorgeous and desirable and if you are aggressive then you are the worst form of woman a ‘whore’. 

In this circumstance I usually use the power of facial expression and give the guy sometin so brutal with my eye that he feels immediately uncomfortable, and also follow this with a long disapproving gaze up and down his body and returning and focusing on the groin area.  Give em some of their own medicine I say, and it sure works from 60 year old men to teenagers. 

Similarly if you are walking down the street just trying to do your ting, and a man blatantly checks your shit out.  There is nothing inherently wrong with appreciating the beauty of the world, of course but it often happens in a disrespectful way.  So I counteract this with the same.  If they are going to check out my ‘womanhood’, then I have every right to check out their tackle.  Men usually get embarrassed and stop ogling at you. 

Fight fire with fire? I dunno if it just means that I am becoming ‘like them’ and approaching the world from an aggressive male perspective but it sure helps me get through the day, and I had a bit of a chuckle last time I did it to a 60plus Indian man who presumed that his fly must have been opened and quickly covered his shit up. That’s how I feel man!

haha, thats a fantastic idea! Maybe I'll try that next time. But yeah your completly correct in your observation that being passive and a woman makes you desirable and being aggressive, confident or assertive makes you a lowly slut. i guess appearing weak and vulnerable makes men feel more masculine and protective so it turns them on more.

theda

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

Context is important in conversation with strangers.  In a bar or at an informal social gathering I think a hello like that might be acceptable in that there is a sort of implied permission to approach just by being there.

As to receiving on the street compliments from women - bring 'em on! The best I have gotten is "Nice hat!" a couple of times when I was wearing a nice Tilly hat of all things.  Made my day.  And from women quite a bit younger than me.

However I am not nearly as good looking a man as you are a good looking woman, Theda, and I can imagine how tiresome it would get to have a string of public assesments of your physique trail you around.  So I for one avoid staring obviously, and / or commenting on the beauty I see on the street.  And I think this is the only appropriate way.  I fyou noticed me looking I might wink though.

Hmmm if someone said the same thing to me in a bar, I wouldn't want anything to do with them. It's just so cheesy, sleazy and blerh. But your quite wrong thinking I'm inundated with compliments, it's a rare but happy occasion when it does occur! But things like that "hello gorgeous" etc are simply insincere and condecending remarks. I don't have a problem if a stranger were to tell me I had a nice hat (well I don't wear hats like you do), or a cool dress or whatever, thats fine, but I think they are two very different things. By the way, whats a tilly hat?

elly

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

strangers that refer to you as "gorgeous, love, darl etc". I don't mind a friend or intimate calling me such things but I really object to total strangers calling me this, reducing me to femininsed adjectives!
i work in a bar and you get that sort of comment all the time, if you let it get to you then you would go insane. i know its not nice but i just don't pay any attention. what they don't realise is that the more time they do that the longer i will make them stand at the bar waiting to get surved. sometimes they stand there 30min and if they get realy affensive like that man did to your reply i bar them. they should treat us with more respect but its not worth losing sleep over.

voyeur2

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

Hmmm if someone said the same thing to me in a bar, I wouldn't want anything to do with them. It's just so cheesy, sleazy and blerh. But your quite wrong thinking I'm inundated with compliments, it's a rare but happy occasion when it does occur! But things like that "hello gorgeous" etc are simply insincere and condecending remarks. I don't have a problem if a stranger were to tell me I had a nice hat (well I don't wear hats like you do), or a cool dress or whatever, thats fine, but I think they are two very different things. By the way, whats a tilly hat?

I do not usually wear a hat unless it is cole, raining or snowing.   A tilly hat is a soft top type of wide brim hat, all cotton, guaranteed to last a lifetime.  The sort that fly fishermen wear in Canada but much more expensive.   It is crushable and a prototype is reputed to have passed entirely through an elephant, and exited inscathed after thorough washing.  Nope I don't fish, but do tell tall tales.  This one is true!. 
And I agree "hi gorgeous' is really cheezy even in a bar.  It is demeaning and condescending, unless you already know the person and use it in a sort of ironic greeting.  In bars, or social gatherings, I usually either stay at a distance admiring while wondering if I am sufficiently attractive to approach (when I was younger) or now that I am more mature just saying hello, with some comment on what is going on while trying not to sound inane.

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Have I ever lied to you before?

vito3dita

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

(...) and said "hello muscles" or "hello tough guy" or something. Or am I just going over the top here?

I don't know exactly what "tough guy" means, i've heard it in "vice city", a cuban guy call Tommy Vercetti like that and this causes me to be proud of beeing called "tough guy".

Seriously, I agree with you, I do not like this kind of speech and it is boring to meet persons with this habit.

vito3dita

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

Seriously, I agree with you, I do not like this kind of speech and it is boring to meet persons with this habit.

[I forgot:]

Thank you for askin', honey.

Belgareth

Member

Re: a question for the ISM ladies...

I was just curious as to what other women thought of strangers that refer to you as "gorgeous, love, darl etc". I don't mind a friend or intimate calling me such things but I really object to total strangers calling me this, reducing me to femininsed adjectives! I was walking down the street about 10 minutes ago and this raver guy said "hello gorgeous". and i said "don't call me gorgeous", to which he responded by calling me a whore and slut and a bitch.
So do you think its overreacting to tell idiots like that not to call me those words? Am I just nitpicking? Or is it a legitimate although minor form of sexism? It's kind of like if I went up to random men and said "hello muscles" or "hello tough guy" or something. Or am I just going over the top here?

You aren't overreactiing! Anyone who uses that sort of expression to gain the attention of a stranger is either, over confident, or spends too much time in Internet chat rooms where everyone is addressed as "babe", or they've been watching too many porn movies. Sadly, if you respond in the same vein, they'll probably miss the sarcasm and think you mean it!

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